There are a lot of different types of Anti-Spyware programs out there. You will not only have to decide whether you want a Spyware blocker or a Spyware remover or a program that combines these two features. You must also decide if your want to pay for the Anti-Spyware program or if you prefer a free program. When it comes to Spyware Removers, some are very expensive, some comes with a small fee and there are also totally free spyware removers available. Most computer users choose to begin with one of the totally free spyware removers available online. Some are lucky enough to find the one of superior totally free spyware removers available on the Internet today, and will stick with this totally free spyware remover. Other chose to upgrade one of the not-so-good but totally free spyware removers available, to an enhanced but more pricy version of the program. By starting out with one of the totally free spyware removers available online, you can try out several totally free spyware removers to find out which one is most suitable for your. Totally free spyware removers available off-line is hardly ever heard of, since it would be too expensive to distribute them. Instead, the programs available on the market today is found online where you can download them directly to your computer – easy and convenient. Despite the enormous amounts of online advertising about this type of programs online, it can be hard to actually find a totally free spyware remover available online. When you read the fine print, you will usually find out the products marketed as totally free spyware removers available online is actually not at all totally free. Sometimes the program it self will be totally free, but the necessary updates costs a lot of money. Since all spyware removers need to be updated regularly to learn about new types of Spyware, such programs will soon turn out to be not-at-all totally free spyware removers available online. Other programs claims to be totally free spyware removers available online, but are only free during a trial period – sometimes for just a few days. As soon as the trial period is over, you will have to buy one of their not-at-all totally free spyware removers available online. The third kind of bad totally free spyware removers available online are those that are so basic that they offer hardly any protection at all against new and clever Spyware. You should also be aware, not all sites with totally free spyware removers available online are run by sincere Anti-Spyware companies. When the public knowledge about the potential dangers connected to Spyware programs grew, the computer users started to install spyware removers to combat the Spyware. The companies that gain from Spyware countered this by offering phoney spyware removers available free online. These false totally free spyware removers available online will not at all protect your computer from Spyware. Instead, a lot of them will even install Spyware on your computer and start sending information back to their owner. False totally free spyware removers available online can seem great, but will actually do more harm than good once you have installed them. Always use a critical eye when you check out a web site that offers totally free spyware removers available online. Only download free spyware removers from web sites that you know have a good reputation.

Remember audio tape? Sound quality was poor, play time was limited, and cassettes wore out quickly if they weren’t first destroyed by the tape deck. Once we caught on to MP3s, there was no turning back. MP3s offered clear advantages over the analog medium they replaced. Now we play music continuously for hours, create custom play lists, and take our music wherever we go. Best of all, we don’t have to lug around all those tapes or discs, because MP3s can be stored on something as handy as a USB key. So while the music goes everywhere, the discs stay at home. Parents of young children, however, still have their share of problems with those OTHER discs: the expensive CDs and DVDs that you need to run PC games and disc-based applications. Once touted as “durable,” CDs are remarkably fragile: hairline scratches or even a few smudges can make them unplayable. Supposedly designed to be portable, they’re not all that easy to transport, but they are incredibly easy to lose.
Too often, shared discs are treated badly. Left out their jewel cases and exposed to kids and pets, game discs are quickly damaged beyond all use. Traveling disc collections are not long for this world: volume 2 of a set may be forgotten in a motel room, volume 3 at a rest stop down the road. The disc-based software that accompanies you on the family trip frequently comes back ruined — if it comes back at all.
MP3-LIKE CONVENIENCE FOR DISC-BASED APPLICATIONS Virtual CDs bring MP3-like ease use and portability to video games, CD-ROM clip art collections, educational software, and other disc-based applications. They’re the perfect disc management solution when you’re sharing disc-based games and applications with members of the family or transporting CDs and DVDs from place to place. You’ll need a CD emulator to convert your physical disc into a virtual CD, or a file that runs directly on a computer’s hard drive. Since it’s just an electronic file, a virtual CD can be stored on a laptop computer or just about any digital storage device.
A virtual CD plays just like a physical CD, only there’s no need to load the physical disc — you simply click on desktop shortcut to launch a favorite game or application. You can have several virtual CDs running simultaneously in one of several virtual drives. It may seem like a silly idea to keep so many virtual CDs loaded, but gamers in particular like to hot swap between titles or volumes.
Although it emulates a physical CD, a virtual CD operates directly on the hard drive, improving playback times by as much as 200% and eliminating wear and tear on the CD-ROM drive. It can be shared over a network, customized to contain multi-disc sets and expansion packs, and organized with other virtual CDs in a searchable library with a Windows-like directory tree. CHOOSING THE RIGHT CD EMULATORMost commercial CD emulators cost between $30 and $60 — a bargain compared to many game titles, and well worth the price of admission if you’re able to spare just a few of your discs from abuse. But while nearly all CD emulators have certain basic features in common, not all offer the same usability and disc support.
You should also be aware that while a CD emulator is a great tool for most PC games, educational software, and unprotected DVDs, any legal CD emulator will not work with a CSS protected DVD. In other words, don’t expect to transform your Hollywood videos into a virtual DVD library.
If you’d like to purchase a CD emulator, you might want to download an evaluation version first. Try to determine which product works best with the discs in your collection. Decide which brand gives you the best value for your money and offers ongoing technical support. FarStone Technology makes a solid CD emulator in the form of VirtualDrive (http://www.farstone.com/software/virtualdrive.htm), which weighs in just under 30 dollars. An evaluation download is available at www.farstone.com.
CD EMULATOR RESOURCESFarStone VirtualDrivehttp://www.farstone.com/software/virtualdrive.htmGeneral Emulator Listingshttp://www.thumbshots.net/webguide.aspx?cat=Computers/Hardware/Storage/Optical/Emulation

Zone Labs is the most trusted name in Internet security, and with good reason. The Zone Labs products are effective at keeping computers protected from spyware, hackers and other Internet bad guys without clogging up your system. They’re also easy to install and configure to meet your needs. Zone Labs’ products offer a range of services depending on what you need and want from an Internet protection program. ZoneAlarm, the most basic firewall program offered by Zone Labs, can be downloaded for free and used for personal, non-business use. ZoneAlarm Antivirus adds the Zone Labs triple-defense firewall, antivirus protection, e-mail security and protection for your wireless network. Zone Labs’ ZoneAlarm Anti-Spyware offers the same features as the antivirus program except with anti-spyware protection instead of antivirus. The added power of ZoneAlarm Pro includes Zone Labs’ identity theft and privacy protection programs, e-mail security and anti-spyware. The all-in-one solution from Zone Labs is ZoneAlarm Internet Security Suite, which includes the basic and triple defense firewalls, anti-spyware, antivirus, identity theft and privacy protection, anti-phishing and spam blocker, e-mail security, instant messenger security, parental controls and protection for wireless PCs. You can also buy the instant messenger security and parental controls separately from Zone Labs in the product IMsecure Pro. These products from Zone Labs can give you peace of mind as they protect your computer from a variety of problems you don’t want to have. Zone Labs can protect you from hackers, spam, viruses, identity theft and more. Stop these menaces before they get to your computer and your information, with a little help from Zone Labs.
Zone Labs is the trusted leader in Internet protection and personal firewall systems. More than 30 million computers worldwide are trusted to Zone Labs products. And it couldn’t be easier to protect your computer from all of the various threats that are out there when one Zone Labs product can do it all for you. The Zone Labs products are easy to install and use but still very powerful. They allow customers to protect themselves without a lot of effort or thought on their part. Zone Labs also allows more knowledgeable users to fine-tune the settings on their products to give them exactly what they need from the firewall and Internet protection package. If you need technical help when working with any product from Zone Labs, you can find support online, via e-mail and through the ZoneAlarm Support Center. Zone Labs is there with you to help make your Internet systems work for you and protect your computer in the best way possible. There’s no better feeling than being able to get online and know that your computer is safe from viruses, hackers and identity thieves. Zone Labs can give you that kind of security.

Are you annoying of adware and spyware every time you open any websites? They have now reached epidemic proportions. They are every where in the cyber world. Here are four methods to remove or simply avoid adware and spyware without spending a dime on the latest “anti-virus” software.
1. Do not use Internet Explorer. Internet Explorer is like Swiss cheese. It is open to the world by default. Microsoft is continually releasing patches to fix all the flaws in the Internet Explorer 6.X and lower versions of the browser. Although it can be “secured” by increasing the security it may loose much of its functionality once set to maximum security with certain exploitable features off.
2. It is highly recommended you should use Firefox. If you don’t use the Internet much, than perhaps you don’t know much about Firefox. All you need to know is that it is a browser that works REALLY well and has great security features.
3. Use a software or hardware firewall (not just Window XP Service Pack 2′s firewall). This may sound expensive and hard to do but it is not. If you have a DSL or broadband cable connection your Internet Service Provider (ISP) may have given you a DSL/Cable router with a firewall built in. All you have to do is turn it on. This may require you to take a few minutes to read the manual. If your ISP did not give you a DSL or Cable broadband router with a built in firewall you can spend anywhere from $20 – $60 (or sometimes even cheaper with a mail-in rebate) to get a router. If you have DSL you will need a DSL router. If you have Cable broadband ISP you will need a Cable Router. Brands such as Linksys have built in firewalls and a feature called NAT, Network Address Translation, which is very effective since it hides your real IP address from the Internet. All routers come with instruction on how to hook them up. If you want to keep you computer security free, just use a free software firewall.
4. Remove spyware/adware with free anti-spyware, anti-adware software. Other two excellent methods of cleaning your system for free are Lavasoft’s Adaware and Spybot Search & Destroy. It is better to use all of the above methods. Being proactive by surfing with a decent browser and getting a firewall is important, but it also helps to know about a couple of good anti-adware/spyware applications. There are many great forums on the Internet dedicated to doing nothing but finding and cleaning such malware. Chances are if your system is infected with it, hundreds of others before you have been infected and have already figured out how to get rid of the malware.

Although they often come with cute names like “I Love You” and “Melissa,” the damage that computer viruses can do to your machine and files is anything but adorable.
For years, the security protocol for protecting your computer has been the same:
1. Don’t open e-mail attachments from unknown senders.

2. Install antivirus software.

3. Make backup copies of your files in case they get corrupted.
The problem with most antivirus programs is that they rely on a “virus database” to scan for certain types of code, based on known viruses. Except that the people who create viruses are always coming up with malicious new ways to infect computers-which means that antivirus software needs to be updated regularly to be effective, and that’s only if the software maker has identified the offending code of the latest virus and created a “patch.”Fortunately, there’s a new kind of virus protection that prevents infection by any sort of virus-and will continue to be effective even as viruses evolve. Known as a “virtual environment,” this sort of technology runs programs and executable files (attachments) in an isolated environment, preventing viruses or malware from harming your computer.
One example of this new generation of antivirus software is Virtual Sandbox from Fortres Grand Corporation. This evolutionary Internet security system uses virtualization technology to isolate and eliminate threats and prevent unauthorized access to personal files, local networks and system settings.
Virtual Sandbox is a desktop security system that takes advantage of virtualization technology, providing the freedom and control to surf the Internet and open e-mail attachments without worrying about viruses and other threats. The program creates an isolated environment on the desktop where access to computer hard disks and personal files is protected, removing the fear of known and unknown threats, including zero-day exploits-viruses that are launched before patches have been developed-that traditional antivirus solutions will never protect against. Unlike traditional antivirus software, it does not degrade system performance with file scanning operations.

Viruses, spyware, hackers, data loss or theft-these are a few of the digital dangers a computer faces. Fortunately, there are some easy ways to protect hardware and your irreplaceable files. An important first step in data protection involves updating Windows with the newest security patches and ser-vice packs. You can do that by enabling the automatic update feature on Windows XP or manually downloading the patches from http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com. Other ways to safeguard Windows XP are described in easy-to-understand language in a new book called “Geeks On Call Windows XP: 5-Minute Fixes” (Wiley, $14.95). The book also offers expert advice and step-by-step explanations of topics ranging from avoiding digital dangers to turbocharging Windows. Here are some additional tips from the book that can help you protect your data. Backing Up Data Protect hard drive data by backing it up on recordable or rewritable CDs/DVDs or separate hard drives. You can also use special software to create a “disc image” of your hard drive. If your hard drive ever crashes, you can simply load the disc image onto your computer, and you will be up and running as if nothing ever happened. Popular disc-imaging programs include Norton Ghost, Acronis True Image, NTI Backup NOW, and Turbo Backup. Protecting Important Files If you don’t want to back up your entire hard drive, consider backing up your most important documents (financial information, digital photos, music files, etc.). Popular programs used for document backups include Nero Burning ROM, Nero Express, NTI CD-Maker, and Roxio Easy Media Creator. Also, be sure to protect all your data by using a password on your Windows account. Know The Enemy The most common reasons for data loss include: • Dead hard drives-Hard drives can give out. It pays to be prepared.
• Viruses-Some digital threats lurking on the Internet can destroy certain files on your computer.
• Power surges-An electrical storm or fluctuation in power lines can cause a sudden burst of electricity that zaps your hard drive.
• Theft-Computers, especially laptops, are big targets for thieves.

In 2002 thirteen-year-old Christina Long, a Connecticut suburbanite, became the first confirmed murder in the U.S. by an Internet predator. Unfortunately she has not been the last. Fortunately, recent media attention is finally making parents aware of dangers linked to Internet use.
A study performed by National Institute for Missing and Exploited Children concluded that in the past year one in five minors were subjected to sexual solicitation through chat rooms and instant messengers. 5% received aggressive sexual solicitation in the form of phone calls, mail, money, or gifts, as well as being asked to meet. Almost 70% of all solicitations occurred in the home, yet less then one-quarter of minors told a parent. Shockingly, by an average age of just eleven years most minors have been exposed to Internet pornography.
Internet predation is an issue that cannot be ignored. The Long family did not realize their children were in peril until it was too late. We must learn from their loss and take action before more children suffer a similar fate. Amazingly, many responsible parents who wouldn’t dream of letting their children cross the street without teaching them to look both ways, or under the supervision of a crossing guard, will let their kids play on the Information Super-Highway without any safeguards!
There are several excellent resources designed to provide education to both parents and children. One of the best is the National Institute for Missing and Exploited Children (http://www.missingkids.com). Here you will learn how to identify dangers and how to effectively address them. As an example, one of the easiest changes that can be made is moving the family PC to a highly visible area, making it easier to watch for risky behavior. There are other valuable tips, such as how to pick chat room and instant messenger user names that draw less attention from predators and what type of chat rooms to avoid.
The most important thing you must teach your children is that the Internet is not always a safe playground where they can let their guard down. Children often have a false sense of security on the Internet because they believe its anonymous nature will protect them, even from behavior that would make them run in real life. Children must be taught that behavior that would make them uncomfortable in person must not be tolerated online either. Most minors would be afraid of a stranger who starting talking to them with sexual innuendo or talking about their sexual fantasies, but fail to be afraid when they are approached online. In fact many children will even engage in conversations when approached, perhaps because the Internet gives the illusion of personal safety.
Children must be taught that giving out personal information is extremely dangerous. Teach your children that even the smallest piece of information, such as what softball team they are on, is enough for a predator to find them. Also teach them that a stranger online is not always who they say they are. Predators will often masquerade as children themselves to obtain information they can use to identify and find victims. Your child may think they are talking to someone their own age, when in fact they may be talking to someone intent on doing them harm.
In addition to education you must put in place parental controls and monitoring tools to add a second layer of defense. Even the best child will break the rules on occasion, and even the smartest child will fail to identify every dangerous situation. Quality parental control software should allow filtering of web sites and permit monitoring of which sites your children are visiting, allowing you to identify risky behavior before it is too late. Instant messenger controls that permit conversation monitoring, as well as permitting limits on which contacts your kids can have conversations with, are invaluable since predators often use these messengers to meet and entice their victims. Another option that is vital, although often overlooked, is a means of block peer-to-peer file sharing programs. These programs are typically used to download music, but can also serve as a portal for pornography, including the most insidious forms of child pornography. Finally, a quality monitoring tool to that allows you to watch everything your kids do will help identify and address risky behavior. The most typical tool for this is a keystroke logger, which logs every keystroke your child makes. Perhaps the greatest value of installing good parental controls and monitor tools is the positive effect it will have on your children’s behavior. They are less likely to break the rules if they know you are watching.
Educate yourself, educate your children, and invest in the tools to make sure they’re safe. Don’t let your family be the next saying they never thought it could happen to them.
Visit http://www.css-software.com for more resources and tools to help protect your children before it’s too late.

If you practice diligence and follow some basic rules then you will have a much better chance of preventing the ability of a malware application from infecting your computer. Most computer spyware today is installed without your knowledge when you visit a website or download an application that will place the application on your hard drive. So one way to prevent the installation by not visiting unscrupulous web sites when you surf the web.
There has been a strong increase in the number of computer malware / spyware out on the net the past few years. Many experts in the field expect the number of infections to only increase as time goes along. Spyware are actually programs that are installed on your computer but you usually do not know of the installation and many times you did not even approve the installation. These programs can cause all types of problems for your computing experience, which range from annoying popups to someone actually stealing your personal data and impersonating your identity. You may also experience a reduction in performance of your system, since many times these programs will consume a lot of computing power as the program performs its tasks. Even though the number of computer spyware infections are increasing exponentially does not mean all is lost and you should just throw your hands up and turn off your computer forever. Since most spyware is installed because of security holes in your browser always ensure you have the latest version of updates for your Operating System and Browser. You can also switch your Web Browser to something like FireFox which is targeted less than the more popular Browsers. Also ensure you have a spyware protection and remover application installed. This is one of the most important items you can do to protect yourself from these infections and help to minimize the chance that you will be come infected with these types of applications

This review aims to make you acquainted with Projetex – a simple and powerful project management tool for translation agencies.
The idea to create single-purpose project management software for translation industry became obvious after desperate attempts to adjust commonly used MS Project and Intuit QuickBooks to the specific needs of translation agency. Projetex is ideal for project managing, corporate and freelance workflow management, data and files sharing within company. It covers all aspects of project managing: communication with clients, corporate experts and freelancers, tracking the project implementation, issuing financial documentation etc., saving the time and energy on every stage. The developer, AIT, have been working, in the translation industry for eight years now and is known to thousands freelancers and translation companies as both a serious translation agency and supplier of effective translator-oriented software (Translation Office 3000, AnyCount, CATCount, WinLexic, ExactSpent, ClipCount). Projetex was developed on the base of the most efficient and time-proved of them – Translation Office 3000, and reflects the considerable experience in managing translation and localization projects. No wonder Projetex becomes popular in other fields (like publishing business or advertising) with similar workflow structure as it provides the tools for coping with most common project managing tasks. The most important advantages provided by Projetex 2006 include: Automatic folder creation, thought-out structuring and simple access release brain space for more important or pleasant things. In addition file management takes up to three times less time. Built-in instruments for issuing financial documents; invoices are linked with jobs, payments can be linked with invoices. No need to underscore how convenient is that! Having all information stored in one place simplifies and quickens the process of locating and correcting mistakes, if any occur. The option of automatic calculation of profitability balance for each project will be undoubtedly estimated at its true worthy by project managers. As well as the other possibility provided by Projetex… …color differentiation for overdue/deadline today/deadline in the future projects, jobs, invoices and graphic scheduler tool for presentation of all current projects, client, freelance, expert jobs and their terms. Price-managing with Projetex: you enter the price only once and do not care about remembering it anymore: the next times you get it simply clicking the Price button. For those, who want to provide the analysis of working effectiveness all kinds of custom reports are available: for example, you can see the dependence between the number of projects from certain client and freelancers involved. Accounting is possible using different currencies for different clients and freelancers. All financials are automatically translated into company’s base currency selected by you so that you can see the complete picture, avoiding multiple manual converting operations and inevitable associated mistakes. Possibility to see separately payments module, invoices module, quotes module etc. allows you to concentrate on the exact task you are working at and not get distracted by the information you do not need at the moment. From the other hand, multi-dimensional view of the database and cross-references gives the possibility to see the consolidated information on particular client/project/corporate expert/freelancer. Thus saving you time and nerves on switching between pages or documents and keeping in mind what information you are looking for and what you have already found. You can make your invoices and PO’s look as pretty/strange/simple/overloaded with pictures/etc. as you want – templates for invoices, purchase orders, quotes, job assignments and price-lists are completely customizable. Connect Offices and share files and database of clients, projects, jobs, freelance and in-house experts. All these together allow project manager to work at a considerably larger number of projects at a time. Projetex will undoubtedly suit small companies as well, where single team members may have two or more of roles combined, due to its flexible and detailed settings for access level assigning. And what users like most about Projetex – all its advanced functions are hidden under the simple, user-friendly interface. It makes Projetex one of the most efficient instruments for reducing time and costs expenses on project managing. Still, words are but wind and the proof of the pudding is in the eating: AIT provides the possibility to “taste” their project management software for 30 days absolutely free of charge (a clever move, as people get used to good things very quickly – and do not hesitate to buy the license). In addition, on registering your copy of Projetex, you become eligible for highly competent and complaisant support (though they never hesitate to help even if you are only evaluating their products).

User interfaces and accessibility are some of the most important aspect of an application. It can have a million features, it can do a thousand things once, but if it doesn’t look quite right then it will be a disaster. Take Linux for example. This open source (free) operating system has been around for quite a while, and it has been very appreciated for its stability and speed. However, in its earlier days it lacked a user interface, which made it very unattractive to the general public. While a few years back Linux was used only by system administrator and computer freaks, Microsoft’s Windows was all over the place, pumped up by its friendly user interface, even though it had a lot of bugs and was very unstable. Today’s things are quite different. People have learned from their mistakes and now, most operating systems, including Linux, use a graphical interface and are very user-friendly – things that in the past you could do by writing lines and lines of instructions, you can now do with a few clicks. This major improvement has brought in a whole new class of users, and the popularity of this operating system has increased considerably.
This is why the user interface matters a lot to the average computer user, and icons are one of the most important issues at matter. But why use icons and not plain text? Well, icons are visual mnemonics, that is, they are easier to remember. We see an icon a few times (or maybe once) and we “learn” it, and afterwords we associate the image with a certain action. The same thing happens with text, but it’s a lot faster to “read” an icon than it is to read a text, which makes icons a lot more recommended. Furthermore, adding icons to the important components of your application will sometimes save you from the frustration of answering the users who are not very familiar with the application and have trouble finding out how to use a certain feature. For example adding a question mark icon next inside the help button will make it easier for users to figure out where they can get help.
Today’s developers know that users will learn how to use a certain application a lot faster if its interface looks like the applications they are already familiar with. Take for example a Mac: can you see how all applications look pretty much the same? So it’s really easy to start using new applications, and you don’t have to read the manual to see what each button does, because most likely you’ll figure out that on your own. But there are two sides to this: if all applications look more or less the same, where is the uniqueness? Then again, if the application is totally unique, users might find it difficult to get acquainted with. So the best way to go is to use an interface that combines both these rules – not an “average” looking user interface, but also not a totally unique one. It’s easy to get stuck with this idea, but this is where icons come in.
Icons are the easiest way to differentiate your application, while still keeping a note of familiarity. Most developers have found it very efficient to replace the operating system’s stock icons with their own custom-made icons. How? Well, start with the little things. Try adding shadows to icons, or maybe apply different effects (emboss, blur, add a border, etc.) using a graphics editor. Another approach is to change the icon’s colors. Make them all blue, yellow, or some other color you might think it would look great with the rest of the interface. A toolbar with enhanced, yet similar buttons (for example replacing the New, Open, Save, Print, Cut, Copy, Paste icons) really improves the overall interface. After replacing the icons, it’s a lot easier to make the next step and start changing colors.
But what to do with these old-fashioned users that like to keep it simple? How about people with special needs, who might have problems reading small texts or seeing some colors. Also, there must be a way for all the people – and it’s really a mystery here – who like the same old icons and colors on all their applications. Fortunately, the answer is simple: different application skins! It’s a good idea to have a “standard” skin for the users who like to keep it simple, offering the basic features in a really easy to use manner, and then to create a few more enhanced skins for the people that like different interfaces – big fat buttons with shiny icons for the main applications features, or perhaps lots of toolbars with many buttons for advanced users. Again, the easiest way to creating new skins is changing the icons and colors. You don’t really have to change the layout of the application and move all the toolbars/buttons/windows around, for it might require sometimes too much work. But replacing icons is really easy. Voila! You have a new skin!
Today’s computer applications are focusing more and more on graphics, and especially icons, while text interfaces are becoming less popular. The modern applications’ interfaces use icons and text as well, but paying a special attention to icons. This way it’s a lot easier for users to learn how the application works, so therefore they will accomplish their tasks quickly. An intuitive interface and standard behaviors don’t require much explanation, and a well-designed application must not get into the user’s way, but must provide fast access to its most important features. This is the general rule which brought Microsoft millions and millions of dollars for it’s main product – the Windows operating system – so why shouldn’t we follow their example?